Future of HVAC

Work To Become Someone Worth Buying From

The client decides at the first 5 minutes of your pitch if they’re going to buy from you or not and beyond that it’s up to you to talk yourself out of the project. Sales is an overflow of life and not a performance of an hour.

In this episode, Sam Wakefield interviews Paul “Tall Paul” Redman from the “To The Point” podcast where they talk about how important it is to up-level yourself though personal growth and with that become somebody that’s relatable.


Future Of HVAC

Future Of HVAC 69:34

SAM: Alright. Well, welcome to the podcast and what will also be on the YouTube channel today Sam Wakefield is here to Close It Now. I am so excited everybody. This is episode 50 of the Closet Now podcast and the guest today is Paul Redmond from Tall Paul. As most of you may know him from the to-the-point home service podcasts. I absolutely love their tagline as well. Cutting through the bullshit. And that is something called Paul what you don’t know is my tagline. Stop being weird and start selling.

PAUL: That’s right. Yep 

SAM: How many times is somebody walking in this walk into a room and going into a creepy salesman’s voice? And we’re like stop it just be a normal normal freaking person. 

PAUL: That is a great point 

SAM: And so that’s it so that’s the awesome episode today this is going to be longer than normal. Normally episodes or roughly 20 minutes, but this is will will go as long as we need to because.

PAUL: I’m a 90-minute guy but I won’t put you through that today. I’ve got I’ve got questions for you. I have to remind myself that I’m here to be interviewed but I like I want to interview you. Man, your story is amazing like two years 50 podcasts I’m I think I’m most fascinated by the fact that you know high-performing salespeople. And high performing sales managers make a lot of money. Right, have a good quality of life. And at some point, you had to come to a point where you’re like you know what you said earlier you talked about lifestyle design which I want to talk more about. But you said you know what I think I want to do things a little bit differently. So I’m just fascinated me I know how much work a podcast is there is a graveyard of podcasts that is bigger than any graveyard I’ve seen before. People start and they’ll do one or two three or four episodes. And they realize like wow scheduling is really hard, production is really hard, it costs money to edit these things talking for an hour is really hard. Getting good guests is really hard. So 50th episode man nice word.

SAM: yeah yeah it’s fine in fact since you mentioned that and you’re right especially being a top producer in a market like Austin Texas for so long is where I get asked a lot where do you sleep you know where do you have that time. So going back into a lot of the early episodes. you know I call it Drivetime University. In fact, everybody listens they understand drive time University that people will talk about that. But so I’m I was driving to appointments I would throw on my voice recorder grab a little look lovelier microphone and just record right my voice recorder. So early episodes you can hear traffic and all these things. But people love it because I mean we’re out there doing the same thing you know using that time efficiently. Because you know as you know what 15 years career the numbers are if you use your drive and that’s it for education it’s the equivalent of three pH D. So that’s yeah so it’s amazing but started. 

PAUL: Yeah, no absolutely, and really the the element of it that I think resonates so well with the people that are listening is the the authenticity piece. And that’s really where we are in the world today whether you’re selling air conditioning or selling software or selling whatever cars. You know all these tools can bring you so much information and and create like a different experience. But at the end of the day in production is it’s so it’s so easy now it’s a easy. you can make this sexy YouTube, Instagram compilation of short videos that tell a story that’s really a bullshit story because it’s produced, right yeah yesterday I had a client up in New Jersey, Campbell Comfort Systems. Brad Campbell, did something as mundane as buying an extra brought a new truck he wrapped it up. Right, and he gave it to one of his technicians well that’s that’s a normal process. That you know you you remember this as a as you know working into places you’ve worked like hey you buy a new truck you wrap it, you give it to a guy. You figure out which one you’re gonna give it to you take tools out of one. You put him in the other. Well, all he did yesterday he did that right that’s all he did not a very exciting story but he recorded it. Right, and he recorded the process of calling this technician in. and told him he really appreciated them and he also appreciated they always took care of his truck. And he wanted to get him a bigger van with more space and had leather seats and all these sorts of things. And it’s like you could have created this you know $10,000 video showing you put showing you you know put this like handsome technician in this awesome truck. And you’re like come work for Campbell comfort systems because we’re awesome. 

SAM: But the model actor they hired for the bold you know 

PAUL: Totally. in for free he was like and I’m holding my phone up for those who are listening hi I’m Brad here’s my guy getting a new truck and you got to really experience like the UM you know that’s special and that’s real and that’s what happens. You know and that’s what when a technician is looking for a place to work. They’re not going to look at that video and be like oh I want to go there and get a new truck you’re going to go. Oh man, the owner was really thoughtful and really told you his technician how much he appreciated and showed him to get him a truck with leather seats. And so I’ve already taken field so all that to say to say you know drive time the whole authentic factor like you can’t over-index on authentic authenticity. All you’re going to do is isolate the people who don’t need to hear your message anyway. a great example of that ‘cause I know we’re going to talk about like online pricing and a bunch of other stuff I don’t know what we’re going to talk about a lot. But one of our guests that we’ve had on in UM out of Arizona is Travis ringing with pro skills and he just sold his company for gobs of money to another company of Southern California. Great great story there well. Anyway you know he puts pricing on his website and guess what he’s super expensive and we asked him you know, hey do you feel like you’re missing out on people who see the pricing and walk away. He said I’m absolutely losing those but I don’t care because I’m keeping my goals without them. So anyways congratulations on 50 episodes. That’s a long way to go.

SAM: Thank you. Thank you. Yes, it’s so much fun we definitely want to dive in. but I’m gonna actually R&D. As you know in our industry everyone is famous for R&D. Let’s have some fun here real quick. Because I’m like you, listening to podcasts I realize, Chris is the one, that’s the party guy. And you were always like always about like to the point. I’m very much like that.

PAUL: That is a very good description. He’s definitely in the fun. I have to have Chris in my life for I would be a very very boring person.

SAM: I love it. So let’s do this but so I definitely want to hear a little more of your story as well as the about about right notes. And the things you guys do and how you support the industry. Because of such an amazing industry where else can you know a high school kid with no education after high school? And I’ve always said this hand me somebody with a work ethic and I will turn them into a 6 figure earner within two to three years. And it in the and pay him to teach him where else in any other industry but the trades can we do that.  

PAUL: so I never even heard growing up like I grew up in a suburb of Dayton OH Huber Heights largest community of brick homes in the country. Come shout out I never heard of people earning six figures like. I just never heard of it and think about all the kids that don’t know that like there’s a real opportunity in their hometown to make six figures. 

SAM: So yeah well yeah six figures about 20 really? 

PAUL: Yeah exactly like what 

SAM: That’s just the start two and that’s the crazy part so let’s do this’s I’m gonna ask you a couple of questions that will be our fun 

PAUL: I need this already by the way thanks Chris this is inspired by Chris 

SAM: 100% out of percent so typically had to you Chris I know you’ll probably catch part of this. if you have dinner with anyone dead or alive who would it be?

PAUL: My father so I lost my dad so easy my last father was nine years old. and I would have dinner with my dad.

SAM: Nice nice that is often love that those those learn fuzzies right but yeah mine similar I would actually but yeah my grandma was like this wild crazy lady growing up you know she was always made jokes about being a nudist and all kind of stuff. And I thought it was fantastic but so would be her or one serious side with for me it would be a Jim Rohn. And Jim Rohn is always been a big influence in my life. 

PAUL: Got it. I thought you said Jim Rome and Jim Rome the sports Yeah some radio show he’s been a big influence in my life I love the way he interviews. He’s done such a good job interviewing a man and not lingering in between questions and asking really poignant questions I struggle with that sometimes and 

SAM: Yeah yeah yeah Jim ROHN right invite in my BIOS of both.  

PAUL: Perfect 

SAM: For things to get better I have to get better for things to change I have to change. so 100% then my life motto and then went especially one of the things were over and over and over my podcast is give more value than you take you. can always give more value than you take. OK, second question you’re entering the ring what would be through the big you know the the welterweight champion right, what would be your fights on? 

PAUL: I cannot believe how many times I’ve sat in the room and heard this question answered and enjoyed every minute and I’ve never ever considered what my fight song or my you know song would be. So thank you for exposing me for not even thinking through that to myself man well we we just interviewed Ken Goodrich and we played that all I do is win song. Don’t even know who sings it. But I love that song like that that song gets me fired up so there it is all I do is win win. And you’re like this 

SAM: I like well that’s fantastic that’s super cool mine would be I mean I’ve been a guitar player forever mine is actually the same song that actually played at my wedding. When the guys walked out its Joseph Yanni crazy awesome guitar player it’s called Satch Boogie. It’s just a total jam so 

PAUL: I’ll have to look at that I’m a jam band guy so I was just like going through my index in my head of of different fish songs that I would play. but the one that came to mind is that all I do is one song.

SAM: I like it I like it good stuff so well cool let’s get into this a little bit

PAUL: Thank you 

SAM: Rhinos strategic solutions and 

 PAUL: You can just call us Rhino like the animals 

 SAM: Got it OK 

 PAUL: That’s it that’s how we roll it it’s Rhino strategic solution right there yeah 

SAM: I’ve heard it several different ways on the different podcasts wanna make sure absolutely and 

PAUL: It’s and it’s spelled and pronounced in all caps, you have to pronounce it in all caps Rhino. 

 SAM: Oh got it 

PAUL: very important 

 SAM: As well it’s very demonstrative I mean it is it so tell me a little bit about your history in you know getting into one how you got into trades 

PAUL: yeah 

SAM: How you end up from trades into supporting role for the train yeah which is sooner Councilman it’s a big leap that most people that are in trades don’t necessarily make yeah and how does that work together for you. 

 PAUL: Yeah absolutely so on as I mentioned I’m from Ohio actually was born in Michigan but grew up in Ohio. basketball players on six today that’s why they call me tall Paul have been six 7th and 7th grade so the name has been around for a while I’ve never valued it until the podcast because now it’s like oh people actually recognize that or I’m able to be recognized outside of like being pollen gangly because of site but now that you know that I guess just as described in podcast anyway I’m rambling. But my point is I played basketball growing up and had the opportunity to play Division Three basketball which is the lowest level of college basketball that you can possibly play. But that gave me the opportunity to be the first person to graduate college from my family. Right and so I got other college and had known growing up I was raised by single mom when my father passed away. I knew that her income was around $40,000 a year somewhere give or take and so my goal when I got out of college was to make $40,000 a year. Because at that point that meant that adult truth or 

SAM: Thermostat was set for your life right.

 PAUL: Exactly like that’s just where my mind was like that that’s what I saw as being and I think in my mind I knew like 80 means you’re really making it and I knew a guy who sold you know drugs for a pharmaceutical company. For a pharmaceutical company legitimately who made who made like 90 sounds like me and then if I’m really good at my job will make 90 and so I got a job at a college. And you know a few years after that had the opportunity to start with Lennox Long story short I had just met someone who saw something in me that it that he thought would that other people would like. Basically they referred me to work for Linux and Linux called me up I was living in Ohio at the time and they offered me a job in Denver Co isn’t it I was kind of looking to move toward Denver anyway that’s what kind of started the conversation and so I started I was 25 years old I started with Linux didn’t know anything. I remember my first couple of meetings you know someone drawing on a napkin you know here’s a furnace and here’s a plenum and here’s the blower and here’s how the air moves and here’s how the refrigerant moves and just kind of describing it to me. and dumb so that started my HPC career and you know I didn’t at the moment no that would make a career I know that but I certainly wasn’t going to make a crack at it. Right, so I have a very this is kind of a bad thing like I I don’t burn bridges and I don’t like to come I don’t like for an opportunity to have been wasted. So like relationships are really important to me like Sam I hopefully get off the phone today we become friends and maintain friends like I know that’s a responsibility I feel. 

 SAM: So agreed that people are friends I just haven’t met yet 

PAUL: Totally yeah exactly and so I never really did say I didn’t like no I was going all in HPC isn’t necessarily true because when I’m doing something I’m all in. so I’m a territory manager or you know those roles these are the guys that are showing up in the office and working on customer service staff and you know helping out with billing issues and bring in some lunch here and they’re really just maintaining the relationship. But my I guess niche in that space was really trying to understand the mechanics of the business and understand how to grow them. Right because all of the customers wanted growth like anything I offered was not outside of the conversation of like yeah but I want more leads and I want more revenue and I want more profit more technicians more trucks like everything was about that. so yeah so at an early age. You know I guess for four years I was a territory manager and did that whole thing and really just learned how to serve customers and at that time had just built a lot of relationships in the HPC space and unfortunately Linux is a national company I got to meet people all over the country. One thing led to another I moved which great segue there I had the opportunity to move to Linux’s world headquarters to work on this you know this program for digital tools to name it very loosely which was really to look out at the future. And look at how consumers and contractors and how many factories and distributors how they consume the products that there’s that Hertz being sold in the market. And the what does the future of HPC look like from a buying selling installing warranting servicing all those sorts of things standpoint. so it was really cool and This is why I’m I have this like unprofessional allegiance toward Linux and biased or Linux and it’s because they brought me to Dallas and literally paid me to learn for two years. Like I just I got to sit right-hand man of who’s now that kwanlin who’s now the VP GM you know Harvard Westlake guy like none of my buddies were hard westpoint guys like this definitely hanging around smarter people than I’ve ever been around and so I got to learn for two years but what was cool about it in that period of time it was like getting an MBA to some degree. But what was cool about it is I got to hear about the HVC industry from a very macro level all the time. so you’re clicking on stately looking from you know from coast to coast different channels different segments of the market and you’re having to really understand like OK what’s going on in this market what’s going on in that market how can you drive different results in this broad in this market so from there I got to Long story short you know I’m on a leadership development kind of track if you will loosely described and had the opportunity to move to two places Austin or Charlotte and we visited Austin we love Austin I still love Austin like I wouldn’t be surprised if I end up in Austin one day time is on me if I’m in Austin I am going to be the secretary for Bobby Jenkins ABC home and commercial I’ve told people that all the time is my my idol we had the opportunity we we chose Charlotte because we could be closer to family so my you getting back in Ohio so Ann had another kid when we got here so four kids in Charlotte and I’m about three years into my gig on the district manager with Lennox and really that was a job that a lot of people can retire like most of the people in that job were don’t say on the back path. But like it’s a good gig like it’s a really good gig. Companies great well taken care of it you can really do well. My whole thought was when I came out here, I wanted to be Hillary in my community. I want to you know go to work at the same place every day and build this team and serve customers that I’m going to get to know they’re gonna become family and friends and all that and then I’ve never told this story way but then I started listening to podcasts like true story. I was driving all over North and South Carolina and someone struck time university I won’t say this person’s name ‘cause I don’t want to incriminate him but I’ve told him this specifically at someone I admire. someone told me to look up this podcast from Tim Ferris and you probably heard some kerosene talk about yeah life sign and he sort of brings on entrepreneurs and well I’m not started bringing he had always brought on different you know thought leaders and things. And what happened was for me is during these drive times it seemed like the pitches were starting to slow down for me. Like all these things out here about those missing growth and entrepreneurship before where they were very like ethereal and I could like maybe take one or two things away I was like oh I can really take that away I can really take that away. And then I got to a point where I was like well really really like I can write all these notes down but to really apply I need to work for a smaller business like I need to work more somewhere where I can really have an impact. 

SAM: And they can actually have some help in steering the ship then 

PAUL: Totally totally indent through that process I met Chris Young who’s the owner, founder and CEO today I brought him as my right-hand man or I’m his right-hand man. And um the minute I I mean not the same cheesy but like the mid I met him I knew I was like this this dude night we’re going to. 

SAM: Business love at first sight. 

PAUL: Well yeah we’re going to crush it together we really are because yeah he had what I was lacking and I had access to some resources that you know normal person like him with access to just. Because of the relationships, I’ve built not anything for the private area but like there are a lot of people that I’ve invested in that invested in me that I hold dear and I’ve yeah You know done I’ve really taken you to know it’s not extreme but serious efforts in my life to make sure that the quality of those relationships remains intact and so absolutely so I left Linux in 2018 so I finished ten years there I’m sorry I was in my 10th year technically. And I started working with Chris and Phoenix on the rhino game and it’s been three years it’s been great we’ve had a lot of fun. we’re in that constant learning mode I was sharing with someone yesterday like you know scale of 1 to 10 like we’ve had we’ve done a lot in the last couple of years but word it too. Like we have so much more nervous so. 

SAM: Absolutely so I love it that’s fantastic. 

PAUL: I never get to talk about Rhino on the actual podcast so this is actually like myself thank you Chris but yeah this is 

SAM: So cool you know and I love what you said there too because you know this is one of the honestly one of the key principles that I talked about in the podcast and we cover really there’s a lot of different styles in different aspects of this. but I’m such a firm believer to relate it to sell for a minute that I really believe people just the homeowner the client we don’t use the term customer customers at one time purchase we use disturbed client decides in the first five minutes if they’re going to buy from you or not. Beyond that, it’s up to you to talk yourself out of the project so the biggest thing that we ever talk about is work to become someone worth buying from. And when you up-level yourself your personal growth through taking classes is the overflow of life. It’s not the performance of an hour and so when that happens you become somebody that just is relatable. Somebody that just people like because you’re you like people. so becoming that person when you run into somebody like yourself and you just click with somebody it just happens that’s why you know they’re talking about business is done on the golf course so it’s not nobody’s talking about business the conversation is hey I like you I like me who have to like yourself first here you like me let’s do business. cool what’s the business going to be I don’t know we’ll figure that out but we just gotta do something together because we just have a great we haven’t a connection. And that’s that’s totally sounds like what you just described there and I’d love to hear that. Yeah yeah and that’s how everything happens in life. 

PAUL: Yeah Chris and I are very very opposite in a lot of ways we have a lot of uhm similar I guess core foundational principles but very very different and how we operate and it works really well. And I think some of that comes out on the podcast to agree very naturally it’s not staged. we just try to be our authentic selves you know in the way we operate the business the way we operate podcasts the way we treat our clients and so on. So then yeah absolutely you’re like a philosopher I love it we could go from so many different angles on this one. 

SAM: Well thanks I appreciate that now it’s what you know where it comes from is you know 15 years of deciding 2V a lifelong learner. So that drive time university we talked about is you know I can’t help when I I can’t help but think on a higher level when it comes to so many things like that. just because when you become something that you’re so passionate about then it just overflows. That is why Jim Rohn is my mentor or even though he passed away in 1998 but because that’s a man and that’s if you think on a different level the things you do rise to a different level. yeah God so but yeah the benefit so cool so I love that story to get into how you went from in the industry there’s supporting the industry yeah and brought those well gosh to be able to sit at that you know sit at the table at such a high level thinker for so long and it’s a big privilege as well. Yeah and instruction is 

PAUL: still very much look at ourselves in the industry and this is what makes it you know difficult when we look at other Internet marketing companies we don’t identify as just your standard Internet marketing company we think of we are in HV AC plumbing electrical Internet marketing company now will do home services. of course, you know more broadly speaking so things like pest control and roofing and all those that we have clients from a lot of different disciplines. But we are in the industry or for the industry from the CEO down to the people that are listening to the calls you know it’s our hope that when someone say and this is how I answer it when someone asks me what I do for a living I say air conditioning. And I’m proud of it and I’m proud to be associated with it and proud to support it so I think that’s what we’re all 100%. 

 SAM: yeah 100% I love it being in the industry so long myself it’s and then working in so many different aspects everything from attic rat pulling ductwork to service to being in you know I like to say project manager or system design specialists.

PAUL: but as opposed to comfort with consultant or comfort advisor correct I’ll tell you you know I’ve had a few people think it was I think it’s ish mail out in California Los Angeles who calls it a project manager. Fault project manager project manager.

SAM: Oh no we gotta we gotta glitch in our glitch in our connection here. 

PAUL: In your video. 

 SAM: Yeah there you’re back OK the last night. 

PAUL: No it’s my Internet means to check here. 

SAM: OK OK I mean I think you’re back now. 

PAUL: So I’ll just go ahead and 

SAM: Last I heard was project manager. 

PAUL: Yeah yeah so you know what where I come from what I have heard since going into the business the the default terminology is retail salesperson or comfort advisor primarily comforted by here I feel like comfort advisor is almost kind of insulting. It’s like I’m going to a car dealership and they’re like oh we want you to meet with one of our transportation specialists right? No I mean I understand but project manager because essentially we’re not when you have someone in your home that’s talking about a project. it’s a project right yeah and it needs to be managed when people are ripping things out of your attic all space if this isn’t just something you’re buying this is a project that you’re going to be involved in. So I think the industry standard should be project manager I think that I can’t think of any other term that really is more suitable. 

SAM: So oh agreed 100% well and two you know one of the things that I I’m all about asking the obvious question. And stating I mean for so many years our industry fell into the trap of you know thinking they had to talk around the subject. And disguise a subject and disguise things as if the client was dumb enough to not know who you are fired there. And there’s a whole model going on in the industry that I’m very passionate about. That it’s kind of a bait and switch there’s a lot there’s numbers that support it there’s no there are things that gets against it but having a sell and in this case, I’ll call it sells person show up on every single appointment with every single technician just for the sheer fact to be like oh this is broken he’s already here. I’m not a fan of that. I know it’s a big model I know a lot of people are doing it but it just feels like it’s icky in in my head.

PAUL: Same I I feel the same way about really structured questionnaires or comfort surveys like who in your house suffers from allergies. Like these are questions that are very important to answer but don’t ask me in that way. Like I’ll never forget when I was buying the car from the this is totally unrelated but the guy was like how many times a year have you lost your keys and I was like never and my wife was like 3 and I was like oh great now I have to buy this you know and I needed it but I wanted to come to an indifferent on different terms but sure yeah yeah there’s create there’s so much to talk about on the communication interaction between homeowners and project managers and really homeowners and really the company. Or to take stuff row just say the brand in general, not Brandon’s brand of equipment but the brand of you know whatever the name of the contractor is. Right, there’s so much room for opportunity and so much missed opportunity right now just in that space. Like you know of course there’s I told someone recently like like if I’m a contractor I’m not worried about innovation right now like innovation like I’ll just do what the other you know people out on the front if this clear later. But I’d be worried about those foundational things really communication and really helping the homeowner solve the problem that they’re calling you for right?  

SAM: Absolutely yeah that’s it Yep step one you’ve got to do that and it of course comes through question yeah and that’s it and so it’s actually really interesting that we’re talking about this too. I want to take us into kind of the future because you’re right that’s where we are currently and you and I both know and so does everybody else that’s paid any attention. the HAC agency industry is you know 10,15,20 years behind most industries wouldn’t come to technology thankfully they are catching up yeah yeah yeah it’s two two sides of the same coin thankfully because we missed out on a lot of the you know the titanic and the big bombs that had happened with innovations. However, it’s so far it’s just enough to be beyond behind that it that’s why the HVAC industry has allowed the industries to come in and take over the home when they should have been the one to own this space for your response and totally because they were so resistant to for example wireless thermostat of all things you know your main your biggest manufacturers trusted word or not rolling and innovating their own random things. And letting everything else take over and that’s just an example. But the same thing when it comes to how people buy. uhm that I’ve been I’m a firm believer and I think you probably will agree with me anything that’s been done the exact same way for 50-plus years is ripe for revolution. 

PAUL: Totally and I want to believe that the model that exists today is going to work 10 years from now and it might maybe maybe we’re further out. I don’t know I do think we have we have the gift of complexity but also the curse of complexity to write because with complexity leads just more questions from consumers about things. So I mean you have people who are gonna be buying their first HPC systems in the next 10 years who never went through this process. So right so I’d like to believe that the model as it stands today will be the same but it’s just not going to. We would be the one outlying industry where the model was uninterrupted I can’t think of another one. so yeah it’s going to be it’s a it’s a different it’s a different ball game. And it’s really one of the things that I think needs to be considered now is like are you going to put yourself in a position where you’re ahead of it or are you going to have to be using you know or over-leveraged with other people’s resources to be able to compete in the new world. right absolutely he’s going to do a better job so you know last week we had Rhino X which we talked about. And we had Gary Gary Vaynerchuk so chairman of Vayner media Gary Vee if you’re on any of the social he is a good friend and partner of ours. and you know he talked about the concept just the concept of you know Google or Amazon or Facebook whoever but primarily Google like you know obviously wanting a piece of the revenue that comes from the business this transacted through their site right they are not a nonprofit. And the possibility of that means that they biotech enabled HV AC company and they start doing it directly and of course, that’s you know that’s a 30,000 foot in the sky. You know could be far out but it’s not unrealistic like within the next two years if not sooner there are goods and services that they’re going to be getting a piece of naturally and it’s going to work well for. For those vendors, the vendors are those companies who want to build that into their system. And use the tools that Google has created being a marketplace for people buying and selling services and goods. But I just have to believe that things will evolve and there will be pressure on the HPC space and they’re we need to be people there to solve the problem for sure. We hope to be there so we can be part of solving problems.

SAM: Yeah 100% grade and that’s you know we talked the old model because you know primarily my my podcast is a sales-focused podcast. you know and you know I I have a I have a course coming out here in the next couple months. I have a you know it’s a proven sell system. You know it’s it’s still it and it’s actually it’s starting to really integrate and I’ve been training to integrate a lot of we have tools within our fingertips are within just the cell phone alone. We can integrate so much technology into our process. But it’s not enough you know where we’re at right now in fact one of my clients up in in Denver home guardian. and so shout out to Peter up in Denver he Peter Rathie it’s home guardian heating and air OK he’s the actually the first person I’ve come across that is using the new model. The reason for that is he’s only been in the HVAC space for about a year he owned a a cigar bar for like 15 years. And did a lot of E-commerce and online sales with cigars especially last year when the bar part of it shut down with the COVID-19 with coded. Then we had to move to the other model and recognize as we know we have such a recession pandemic proof industry. So he partnered with a technician and started this company. And what did he do he instantly put all of his products online.

PAUL: Yeah I’m looking at it right now.

SAM: yeah if you’re in the Denver area boom you can just go in and price your system with all of your price books right on the website. Now that will probably scare the pants off a lot of owners and contractors. Yeah but in the moving forward that’s the as the generations age people this is how people buy now. They’re not and you probably know the statistics the average North American buys 1.3 heating and air systems in their lifetime. So they’re gonna do this once maybe twice yeah and they don’t know how to buy things they didn’t learn how to buy Nexus or from their grandpa their dads or whoever. They just buy things online so why not do this too. So it’s an interesting new model that’s happened.

PAUL: well I I agree and I think that I think that’s the next big wave of change that needs to come and there’s a couple of reasons why and it’s really driven by a lot of things. But really it’s information is at consumers’ fingertips. And the number one thing they want to no is how much it’s going to cost. And just the thought to get an accurate number or within let’s say 10 or 15%. Right then just thought that it requires you to bring multiple people outside your house to go through their sales presentation. Right, it’s actually kind of a survey or be like if you think it’s awesome it’s a very archaic way to do it. so I think the next big wave is for contractors to just you know understand that they’re going to they’re going to get the information somewhere. They’re either going to get it misinformation from some garbage website online right or which you’re gonna get every year they’re going to get it from your competitor. Right and maybe from you and maybe they buy from you maybe they don’t. But really what you’re trying to do this is about trust not only do they want the price they want to know am I getting the best deal now this deal might be 25,000 in my 12,000 it might be 2002 right but no one wants to go into to a decision like this a major purchase like this and feel vulnerable or naïve and that is the biggest issue. So like if you and I’m trying to think of just all of the things you buy for your home or or for whatever like you’re constantly asking for like is this right is this right the number one question that I get all the time is and they said it was 6500 which is fine but is that right is that high is that low. Like we need to remove the barriers for consumers giving this information set some caveats to protect you so you’re not losing money. And just give all the information to people that’s what they want to save yourself some drugs and I mentioned caps you know if I mentioned it on the air or mentioned it free podcasts but you know Travis Rainey pro skills out in out in anthem Arizona yeah yeah yeah he put all his pricing on his website and he’s not a cheap company. He’s a very healthy company that just sold a really really cool transaction and we asked him on our podcast human aren’t you worried about the people who saw your price and didn’t you know pause too expensive like no because quite honestly like we’re so busy that we couldn’t get to those people anyway. And it’s like wow yeah well. 

SAM: You know that’s the thing they think you’re right the thing that’s happening is you know so I’ve always been a firm believer if at the end of the day on average if we have a 50% close rate. If we can draw a line through the center of the demographic and take the top half. I’m OK with that I mean that’s not a bad thing and by having prices up front that screams out because we all know that client that comes in and they beat you up on price they’re doing the shopping so all the price comparisons they want the most for free you cut on the break and then what happens is the client that complains the most the most problems will go wrong with that project. They ended up taking that project into the red almost every single time. So then after the next three projects that you sell take every bit of that margin to cover that one bad project which could have been screened from the beginning by this kind of model. 

PAUL: Totally yeah yeah and we all know that like there’s a lot of complexity and difficulty to providing an exact price over the Internet based on a series of questions that the consumer could very likely answer incorrectly. Right, but you need to be able to simulate the experience they need to be able to filter into sort and to get comfortable with the range of pricing that they might be experiencing. they know it’s going to cost money they know it’s going to cost more than they want to spend they know it might cost more than they have it might cost how much they have. They want to be able to apply for financing without having the contractor involved they want to be able to do that ahead of time. Alright, they wanna see if they can use their you know PayPal buy now pay later whatever that’s called pay overtime. They want to see these privately then they don’t want to ask when you come into their house and this is this is the curse of being likable. so if you came into my house and we hit it off and he really connected well I think he’s probably the one go with he’s you know he’s a little bit higher than less guy blocked if I were having credit issues or if I didn’t want to tell you that she only have 2000 down cash and I have 3000 on my credit card and I need to do you know to finance for 3rd. I don’t want to have that conversation with you I want to do that privately right so that’s natural. right so those are things that and the future of UM you know HV AC those are things I do think about like how can you simulate the by I hate to use word simulator I can’t find a better one buying process to give them further down the cycle that when you come into your house all you’re doing is bringing a confirming that OK these guys are owned by the way if they choose how to consider costing generally 600 bucks everyone understands. 

SAM: The challenge is quiet but there’s there’s so many different pendulums first ever in the history of the industry is the struggle is and if the price is upfront there’s no opportunity to build the value first. ‘Cause we all know that when we talk about money that’s what most people don’t get go we subconsciously know to are or is it will be so much money is just a representation of something else. It’s not a preference Oh my name is a representation of the time she’s saying the energy that somebody goes to work gave that part of their life away in exchange for this representation of that time and energy that they’ll never get back. Now is this stack of value higher than this money that’s my stack of money here and the second that stack of value gets higher that’s when the questions come out and can we get started what’s the next steps right. and so in this conversation when we apply that’s why of course additionally show prices until you’ve gone through all of the items but now this new the way things are going things are moving how do we are you still show value at the same time. And that’s why a lot of the you know it anybody’s there’s a lot of in-home appointments. There it’s become such a blended model. I mean so part virtual or even complete virtual appointments now over Zoom especially with go vets the best gift we ever got as the industry is giving us the ability to go virtual in an industry that nobody ever thought would be possible. Sure yeah add but how do we do that or the blended model of OK let’s go grab measurements and then we’ll do the rest of our appointment virtually and get pricing to get all those things? And of course, you’re right riding in the caveat says OK have the homeowner select with is and have the verbiage in such as is this an easy installation? Difficult installation extra difficult installation you know your own home how would you pick it. To cut those questions to get the customer engagement but just through that format, there’s yes that’s the struggle how do we do the value at the same time then just growing numbers. 

PAUL: Absolutely in another way I look at it to is I want the homeowner to see the entire range of the price book like a nominee visioning my world you know on the website or wherever. they can see Oh my gosh there’s 75 different combinations of systems that could go to my house go into my house and one of them is 3500 and one of them is 35 thousand I want to bring these guys over to seek to help them help me make the decision. because they’re gonna they’re going to help land where they’re comfortable financially. I also think that that time so so back up to we talk about building value which is incredibly important. Right in the in the days when I started in years before you know you build value by going into the home and having your book. And in your book you’ve got your company picture and your company story and your drug test and you’ve got your licenses and you’ve got a couple of sample permit letters from the inspection board that says you’re awesome you’re doing all these things. 

SAM: Right yeah you get into your car insurance certificate you get in.

PAUL: That was absolutely game-changing and necessary at the time. That was bringing the industry up to a standard instead of just like scribbling stuff down. So that’s important I still think it’s super important today. The challenge they’re going to get that information if they really want it today. They’re getting it through reviews they’re getting it off your website getting off Facebook. They’re getting that information you have to fill in the gaps. But if you wanna take away that price reveal momen.t you know that this you want to take a liquor chaumet when the guy asked me how many times I lost my keys and I lied to his face in front of my wife and said zero. Because I was like this is gonna cost me $1500 right? I’d much rather go get some keys made on the way home after buying this truck and it not cost me $1500. so that’s what you need to take away is just and that’s what I think Travis did groceries he took the elephant out of the room hey we have stuff it’s expensive there’s lots of it we should probably help you pick the one that’s good for you. 

SAM: And have a normal freaking conversation like I said. Stop being weird and start selling right cut through the bullshit like yells tagline. You know if we cut the fat well that’s the remember and the company obviously failed for other reasons. but remember when the Saturn car Saturn vehicles came out? Their entire process was we don’t have salespeople are prices on the window this is what you pay for. And people loved it no there’s no we don’t negotiate this just it is what it is. You get the value that you get when you buy what we sell and so to take that model and that concept into something that’s been so traditionally secretive. And you know especially in the industry when you can call on paper five companies ten companies from your town they all have the same award they all have the same accolades maybe they all have 1005 star reviews so on paper it’s the same company. But the pricing is wildly different for what looks like the same work. Why is it that only gives our industry a black eye from a customer’s perspective like we we can’t tell who’s lying and who’s not because they all say the same thing how do I move the difference? 

PAUL: Right in and imagine a world where and again this is totally hypothetical but maybe you have to have pricing on your website with consumers aren’t dumb they know that it’s an installed piece of equipment they know that there’s insulation they know installation may vary. And so like I’ll go as far even to say and I’m going to get me over this or And. 

SAM: I’m all about pushing the limits. 

PAUL: For certain installed systems I’m not against MSRP. Like that works in the auto industry and then you work discounts out of that and kind of standardized and everything. I don’t want to take margin away from the contractors which takes me into a completely different conversation about the Internet and about e-commerce. But I think that’s a standard item that would save everyone a lot of time and people will realize that. Oh wow if I want a nice air conditioning system installed by the good company it’s not even insert space if it’s yeah 786 hundred there and it’s 4000 there but that guy doesn’t have it on the site. So he’s probably doing like right maybe it needs to be illegal to not have the pricing oversight there completely that was that that was writing well.

SAM: Yeah so you know that because for years I’ve had this conversation with people just in passing of our industry has done such a poor job of educating fun because how many times do we go to a house and what we here is I have no idea using the range that this is going to cost. So take the autumn I don’t need you know like the auto industry for years right on the TV commercials. MSRP is $52,000 in every single year those numbers changed so because of their price conditioning the customer this is what it’s gonna be when you the range it’s going to be when you go to buy this. So there’s no surprise that you go to buy it $50,000 brand-new truck. And you know air conditioning industries never done that yeah. 

PAUL: And what happens is that a $3000 rebate on a brand new truck feels like a $3000 rebate. and you wonder why you sell nicer bigger trucks. and you wonder why like manufacturer rebates like that really aren’t that big of a deal and they don’t drive as many high-end system sales as they should. And I am twisted mentioned client systems I can’t go here for a moment. You know tired of 

SAM: Always sold 50% or greater top-end equipment.

PAUL: Totally in the industry is 95% not. Right, they’re selling a minimum efficiency minimum standard single stage single speed. And I think that’s a big disservice to homeowners I’m not saying that because I make commissions selling high-end stuff I make zero. But right now the only like motivator is you know the salespeople who are good enough to communicate and have a good enough incentive structure to sell the higher-end stuff. Those consumers benefit from things like variable stage cooling. right that no one in my neighborhood but me has right and like but the thing that surprises me is why I refer like everyone knows I’m in New York and sentence I have to tell people I don’t actually take their internal done. But I send my I send my contractor buddies and my contractor friends out. Like I’ve got my guys right I send them to my friends at homes all over the area. And most of them will be like I didn’t even know that two stages was a thing you know variable speed wasn’t awesome it is having a variable speed blower like it’s amazing it’s like and I’m not selling them here I have one I have a two-stage 80% variable in my attic in a 98% modulating variable in my crawl. And then so nice to know and to feel that like love it man like Nolan everyone left at my house my house is always so comfortable. I’m not selling it for a living. I think any benefit of this I paid for that right. It’s really really nice it’s really nice when I have people over and they go out back and they hear my 26 years systems just kind of coming along with no or they don’t yeah it’s just as acting on and those are things that like.

SAM: Little nugget for that just a quick pop out for all of the all these salespeople out there listening to your project manager start calling yourself project manager because we all know we manage it all the way through the end anyway. You’re driving you know parts over if the instructor forgot or you forgot to put on the list bullet but when you’re talking about modulating equipment to the homeowner remember you know maybe one in 10 buys it for savings. It’s not about that. It’s about how they don’t want to know how it works when you know how it’s gonna make them feel so when you describe it that way just like Tall Paul is describing it right now that paint those word pictures of were in the backyard, having a barbecue and we can have a normal level conversation and nobody has to speak up to talk over the loud as air conditioner right beside us that is the moment those clients will relate to. So use this terminology it’s the most boring heating and air system you will ever own. It’s always the right temperature you’ll forget you even have one because it just works you never hear it and you never have to mess with it exit. 

PAUL: Here’s something that I’ve never even thought of until till you just said that nothing this is this super important selling feature. So my wife and I are masters on the main floor and our two units or right outside our master bedroom window which you can’t hear. you just cannot hear them through the window but that’s not even the story and table the story is my wife is like a hippie you naturalist environmentalists and she wants to use electronics as infrequently as we possibly can. And we automatically have the argument of who likes it cooler when we sleep I like it really cold like I like yeah it is at 65,66 degrees and I’m in one of those swing seasons right now where like in the winter time it’s easy I dropped down to 62 and it stayed about 63,64,65 in the room. We wake up she’s cold she puts on the robe no questions asked. Right now I’m controlling all this from my phone. Well right now I’m in a swing season where it’s I don’t know it’s like it’s probably almost 80 out today but tonight it’s gonna be around 50 and it’s one of those nights the house is naturally with a little bit of cooling. It’s probably gonna sit around 72 when they go to bed. Yeah if I go back it’s stagnant exactly I can’t say insert me too. But if I go over to touch the thermostat she’s gonna be like do we really need to turn the air on list this proper window which I don’t like to do. right so I make the adjustment and I put it down to 65 or whatever. And she can’t hear it. So she doesn’t even know. And she sleeps amazingly. Did she sleep amazingly and say why that’s a really cool feature too. and I again don’t sell this stuff for a living I never have I’ve never sold their condition in my life. But my point is this consumers by neighbors your neighbors they need this stuff they need this stuff. And it’s so important to bring so much value and all we’re doing the industry is going out and replacing these 10, 15, 20, 30 years old systems with the same technology that was in before single city. I live in an area where there’s $1,000,000 lake homes with you know 14 clear equipment. yeah it’s really. 

SAM: It’s an in with hundred hundred plus years old technology. 

PAUL: Totally yeah so I don’t I can’t I can’t solve it from where I am all I can say is that contractors you know all need to band together to elevate the industry and that’s really what our podcast is all about and really our company about elevating the industry let’s make it better for you know. I’m not saying collude and make it so that we can you know the industry can extract more value out of homeowners I’m saying my neighbor needs a freaking variable speed air conditioner. And it’s awesome and he doesn’t even know they exist 

SAM: Yes well that’s it that’s the education failure our industries failed to educate clients add number I mean a two-stage system is 50 years old so two saves compressor stage two stages and nobody even knows nobody even knows it exists. 

PAUL: Two stages is the most common sense thing ever and again I’m not blaming the project managers of the companies but there’s some sort of disconnect and then maybe they can’t fix it not again I’m not shaming anyone for not selling their stuff great uh some of the most successful companies I know sell single stage 14 seer here in the South. And they’re amazing or $100 million companies that will never ever touch the amount of success they have and they do it one way and they do it the right way their way. Yeah it’s just there I think there’s more for the industry.

SAM: Like that hamburger you this is what we do pre-fickle this on the burger and this is and but or the best at it awesome. Agreed new and I’m 100% with you you know honestly that’s exactly why it started this company Close It Now, the brand the the sales training. You know I did six months of podcasts before Favor did any business I just wanted to start the company because it’s a little bit of stuff we talked about earlier. you know I sent a couple of my team to training then and they came back and said you know fairly renowned training and they came back to our company with the same slide deck that I took the class a decade ago. And it’s like man this is things have changed technologies change moving forward. So that’s and so for six months and I just I just put out content and podcasts on tips and how to be better just to help everybody. And until one guy my very first client he will always go down in the history books getting Mark and out of he owns on the Mark heating and cooling in Chicago and he is he’s growing he’s doing amazing things. he’s it’s everybody remember that it doesn’t matter how much you learn or you know success happens is the speed of implementation it’s how much you apply and how fast you apply it will determine how fast you progress and move forward and grow. But he’s using my yeah there you go.

PAUL: When we say it to the point rocket right that one down. 

SAM: yeah Twitter Twitter quotes today. but what I mean is his story if we had one, he did 3 1/2 selling single-stage equipment and never sold for over 16 years for single stage systems. We had one conversation and the very first week he’s like $19,000 variable speed system he’s like and now he does it all the time every week. Right but it’s a matter of the education moment it’s like Popeye contractors don’t know how to talk about it. So many of us in the industry came from the technician side and not understand how to have the benefit conversation and how to paint those pictures here describing the barbeque in the backyard. And so that that’s exactly why I started that it’s like these times are changing like that to embrace this. And I don’t mind being the pioneer you know pioneers think there’s a way to take all the arrows they’re also the ones that find the goal first. So let’s let’s let’s raise this industry because it’s one of the most amazing ones to be at but we’ve got to make some adjustments or what we’re gonna find is you know we’re going to be fighting off outside the industry companies coming in to try to take over our space. So we just need to grow and become bigger. It’s an abundant world there’s plenty for everybody that should be better at what we do than our own competition right.

PAUL: I agree 

SAM: for sure so awesome and I love this I think we’re wrapping up from I’m here for it today and this has been a fun visit. I definitely wanted to give you guys more in the future ‘cause I I think we’re much more alike than we are different. after this conversation and so it’s real quick I’m gonna hit on a couple of things about closing it now and where we’re close at now is headed. Yeah and then would definitely want to hear from you about Rhino how and all the services you guys provide. How people can get ahold of you and all that. So closing out this is the tickle moment as I met everybody this is the two year anniversary of closing it now. Big moves I’m doing this if you didn’t know I’m doing this full time now. That’s how I’m able to progress much faster it implements clicker say to his sets special so things that are going on 1st is and you may have noticed some issues with the website in the past. Some of the links that had some issues all of that is getting fixed and a complete restructuring there. Also, I am I’m not at this point I’m taking an affiliate partner if you do something that supports the industry. I would love to talk to you. so affiliate partnerships are are opened up now up now I’ve but I’m looking for the best quality best value for everyone who listens and you’ll be able to get some discounts and stuff through through the delete partnerships. So really working with all your listeners to provide the best value for everybody just for being involved with Close It Now. As this subscribing to Drivetime University like we talked about. Also, the course is coming out and a book coming out in within the next few months. I still watch for those and the course will both be it’s gonna eventually be an online platform. It’s gonna run to be able to grab ahold of it if you don’t have the time or the level of investment for coaching. Also, the coaching program is expanding we’re going to be doing private coaching and group coaching as well so two different levels of coaching. But that will be limited spots because my time is the can only do so many things in the hours that we have right. so but won’t be on the lookout for that as you know CloseItNow.com is where you can find all of that information for me look for the Close It Now podcast of course on Apple podcasts and all the different platforms like around like 20 something different podcast hosting sites now. Now for you Mr. Tall Paul you know about Rhino how can people get ahold of you what else do you guys offer? And how can I get ahold of it? 

PAUL: Yeah so what what we do First things first we’re an Internet marketing company all things digital for home services primarily HV AC plumbing electrical. If you’re listening to this and you’re in another home service give us a call reach out we can probably help you but our core is HPC plumbing and electrical. We have clients all throughout EU S in Canada and and all things from website design to full lead generation campaigns. So I was just on a call with a client who needs you know 200 leads per month to hit their revenue goals for the year and their growth goals for the year so we’re putting together a custom plan for them to do just that. So wherever you are listening right now there are people in your market searching for what you do they’re just not looking for you and they’re not looking for your competitors. And it’s our goal that they would find you call you connect with you and and you get some service or install revenue from that. So we’re at our core value is transparency so we believe and removing the Gray area for understand exactly how much you’re getting and what revenues coming from work and really isolate new business marketing. So yeah you can reach us after a website so ryn OSS or rynoss.com or you can look us up on LinkedIn or Facebook, you can look at me it’s Paul Redmond, you can look at our founder and CEO Chris Yano, it’s YAML LinkedIn Facebook Facebook Messenger you’ll find this.

SAM: I love it I love it I appreciate all that so add everyone listening as you know when this gets posted it it will also give a blog I’ll make sure to have all of those and those links and connections basically all of the linktree attached to that blog. So if you’d be able to easily find Rhino strategic solutions there are one thing we forgot to talk about let’s talk about this perfectly before we go Ryno X Oh yeah yeah yeah 

PAUL: yeah so Ryno X was two weeks ago we had about $2 billion worth of HV AC plumbing electrical home service companies in our office. It’s the first actual event that we’ve ever done its inaugural then correct it was in person yeah. 

SAM: Huge high 5 for that.

PAUL: ’cause I was half vaccinated at that time but I was man I’ll just tell you like there was no social distancing. We were handshaking high fiving and hugging and man. It felt so good 

SAM: So we’ll make sure the social distance police don’t care that’s. 

PAUL: Exactly I think most people are vaccinated. 

SAM: But of course, at the end of the day you probably have you know new or quality products in your office right.

PAUL: We do, it was fine but we had 30 contractors out but what was really cool you know if you’re paying attention to the HVAC spaces are related to like mergers and acquisitions. Obviously, that’s a really big deal one of the highlights many of so many different things but one of them was you know Ken Goodrich from gettle, a campaign from the wrench group in Leland Smith from Service Champions you know together are easily a billion dollars’ worth of revenue. and they had never been together two of them had met before in passing but they they had never been in a room together for a full day full events sitting right next to each other collaborating last word and so to have them don’t have complete different perspectives of how they’re growing their business right. You have Ken Goodrich trying to get allies in North America right. Yeah in Haines who buys all these awesome companies and they retain their image many of Leland Smith who’s doing remarkable things in California the service champions. all with different perspectives on technician pricing on moving on like all the all have completely different perspectives and they’ve got to sit on a panel who shared their perspective it was so incredibly cool to just have that unity in the industry to ensure that the other people there so I mean in Gary vaynerchuk so Gary V. course yeah and and had dinner with us and we got to talk to Gary v. about you know marketing and full and operations and and he’s a really really really special person. And I I shared this with a group there like I I don’t get upset over like celebrity business people like I think charging people just business people. But he’s pretty special like he brought a lot of value and had a lot of really good things to share. so we will do it again we had it was an experience I mean just not spoil everything but I mean every touch point of the event was highly curated by our CEO to create what we consider the most special experience in the home service industry. and that’s why we kept it 30 participants we wanted to make sure row it made it really so sure but yeah it was a great event and knowing knowing our CEO for 1-2 years is probably not enough for him I’ve joked around about. You know Ryno X in the fall and it’s only half joking so sure we’ll see beyond the lookout.

SAM: OK so moving forward do you think it’s going to stay that size and just do more of them or potentially be a bigger event.

PAUL: I don’t know I would I would lean toward there being multiple events one of which is small and one of which is bigger. and the reason I say small is the the main feedback we got you know ongoing during the event then afterwards was how it was really nice to be able to connect with everybody. Like you go to a big dealer meeting you go to like you know Expo or whatever and you’re just kind of in passing and you’ve got this vendor booth we didn’t allow any vendors in. OK, so no vendors there were vendors in town or posting events it it restaurants and things like that but the guys could go to and we were like blown away. Yeah there’s even now much relevance right to sure but we’re not. 

SAM: Actually one of the guys in one of my Facebook groups, Travis from up in it would be at all was it Oh yeah yeah yeah got and 

PAUL: I got to sit next to him during dinner I’ve never met him I had a dream about him before which is really weird. but I love to remove Travis yeah so I remember reading articles that he would write for HR yeah I think it’s easier to news and I don’t even know how I know we became friends on strike Facebook his dream about him and I told him that and it was awkward as it sounds on this podcast. But yeah he was there and he sent us a thank-you gift which always wanted to remain anonymous. But it was really fast if they’re there right now that’s good yeah great great event so thank you for asking. 

SAM: So cool yeah absolutely so moving forward everybody that’s listening and paying attention. Because these events are I really stopped the event via social media and the different people that I know that I’m friends with that we actually attended. UM if you get the chance make a chance make make way and the ability to get there you know this is one of those things you could never invest in yourself and in your company too much. Because their skills that you will never lose it’s something nobody can take away from you. Know we we talked about initially you know follow stalking about the having that thermostat set of where he thought success was in his life. and you know the whatever mark that is for you if your thermostat is set at my business does 250,000 a year or a million a year or three million a year wherever your thermostat is this is instantly a way to change that thermostat. ‘Cause we’re sitting in a room with guys whose own company is doing 50 million a year 100 million a year those those kinds of numbers do you think that even one thing you take away and go home with could completely revelist revolutionize your company? You will function at a different level. so make the investment to get one of these events when the opportunity arises because of high value there.

PAUL: It’s like in the fall Chris you’re listening to good stuff. 

SAM: OK so awesome so that wraps it up today I appreciate so much you taking this time out of your busy day to be a guest here on the Close It Now. So sales trading podcast this is the stop being weird it’s start selling. so I’ll wrap this up in episode 50 how we have wrapped up just about every episode so far is to go out there and save the world one heat stroke at a time go save the world one frostbite at a time. You are out there to change the world and make it an awesome day. Thank you so much, everybody. Will talk to you again soon.